[TC][ilvl 579-582] Frost Stats & 18974 Haste

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Akraen
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[TC][ilvl 579-582] Frost Stats & 18974 Haste

Unread postby Akraen Thu May 29, 2014 1:18 pm

Disclaimer: The data you see before you is not based off actual gear profiles, instead it uses logic based off crit gain intervals with the purpose of spotting a trend. The following assumptions were made:
Stat budget of an item level 581.80 mage with item level 580 Purified Bindings of Immerseus.
Yu'lon, Stormlash, and other sources of damage excluded from the analysis would not be significant enough to skew the data.
This assumes 100% uptimes and all raid buffs.
This assumes static ET's for now, and will be updated soon (w/the help of Frosted) at which point I can potentially update this for ilvls 582-588.

Stay tuned to an update to my guide with this new information.
Frost Mage 5.4 - Explained (sort of)
Up until this point, those of us who try to take a stab at theorycrafting frost mage have fallen into the same traps. We backward engineer parses to try to explain results. Data has been obscured, often with too much information or influence from fights themselves. I could create a "solution" such as 14242 haste->mastery to explain successful parses, but I couldn't explain why I perceived that to be the best method.

We advanced further into the "multiple builds" theory - which suggested that there was a choice among mastery, mixture, and haste builds, each with their own advantages or disadvantages.

DPET numbers were used to help explain the differences-- and the data was not surprising. We know that the way our stats work together is like a system of checks and balances-- no one stat scales each spell, and some scale each other or inhibit each other. This interaction is not too difficult to map.

In some prior posts, I explained the value of crit to a frost mage, but I still had some lingering doubts as to whether it would exceed the amplification of stat ratings from PBoI. Turns out it does not.

So I wanted to find some new logic-- a new angle to analyze the problem. Simulations are a mindset that have to be put on the back burner until we first look at how our actual stats are impacted by Purified Bindings and what that means for average damage, DPET, and which stats add the most DPET to all of our spells.

I started by setting up a series of 6 experiments, using haste as a control for each setup. Within the 6 experiments there would be a series of up to 12 combinations of crit/mastery, starting crit rating at 1500 and increasing it in intervals thereof. PBoI's amplification was used to calculate how much rating that left over for mastery. Don't worry, it's unlikely you'll get to the ideal number of 18969 haste / 1500 crit / 24000 mastery-- that might not even be possible, but the goal is to get as close to there as possible while preserving the LB/NT breakpoint.

For each of the 6 experiments I began with the raw, unaffected-by-PBoI average damage (crit included) and then created a formula to reverse-engineer the crit rating, apply the amplified bonus, and add it back in to the average damage. This creates a clean, verified value that we can use to create DPET tables:
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Then it just takes some cast times to find out DPET!
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Now at this stage of the analysis we can look at how crit/mastery relate to haste by pinning each of the 6 experiments against each other. Remember, we are not adding up the DPETs here, or doing any simulations. The only logic here is that changing stats influences DPET, resulting in a very easy-to-read trend analysis. Green = Good; Red = Bad:
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From there it is simply a matter of looking at the sum of the gains on a percentage basis. This means ET%s don't matter, simulations don't matter. The % gain from one stat combination versus another stat combination. These DPET calculations could be extrapolated into a simulation, but they don't need to. I call this experiment Differentials By Spell:
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As you see above, the impact the change in build has on Frostbolt + Icicle is relatively small, but becomes significant at the highest haste breakpoint.
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Brain Freeze comes out to be the biggest loser as haste values increase and is the outlier for shatter cap as well. However keep in mind this doesn't take into consideration the increased proc rate that comes with haste!
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Ice Lance DPET levels out as one would expect, at 50% haste. Though this does not take into consideration additional FoF procs from having a higher amount of haste!
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Water Elemental does something funny: he loves haste! His stats fluctuate with ours, and he takes a tiny advantage by being in our ideal stat ratio of 18969h>mastery
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That Living Bomb breakpoint is huge and ultimately is what decides our ideal stat ratio. However, crit's benefit does not do enough to give crit a lead over mastery in the overvall view. (ps: no idea why one of those cells is white)
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Frozen Orb stops gaining DPET past the GCD. Nothing to see here.

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Now remember, I'm not simply adding DPET values here, that would be a horribly inaccurate representation of data. The goal isn't a simulation, and the conclusion is startlingly clear because the ignored factors (such as procs) would give haste an even larger advantage, but it's just not needed to prove the stat scaling. This is an aggregate of the % of gain you receive in various stat builds, resulting in higher DPET across the board, influenced by Purified Bindings of Immerseus.

The purpose of this analysis is a demonstration of what stats mean to your spells. It is still a true statement (and an important takeaway) to note that these results will fluctuate depending on the encounter scenario-- on spoils for example, haste at any level conquers mastery, while the reverse is true on Iron Juggernaut. Always pay mind to that fluctuation and note that it is reasonable to set up your frost mage in any way, this is simply the best explanation for how to gear, gem, and reforge from now until 6.0.

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Kver
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Re: [TC][ilvl 579-582] Frost Stats & 18974 Haste

Unread postby Kver Sat Jun 07, 2014 4:11 pm

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Me at 14242 haste, probably going to try this and get some ranks.
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Re: [TC][ilvl 579-582] Frost Stats & 18974 Haste

Unread postby nathyiel Sat Jun 07, 2014 9:51 pm

Very very good post. You just forgot to include that "if you haven't a headache yet, just read another time"

So globally, in theory, is at 50% (or is it 62.5%) haste with 24k mastery and a the rest in crit.
But it's also a good thing to keep in mind that it's in theory and things will change again boss in the game.
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Akraen
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Re: [TC][ilvl 579-582] Frost Stats & 18974 Haste

Unread postby Akraen Sun Jun 08, 2014 5:41 pm

Very very good post. You just forgot to include that "if you haven't a headache yet, just read another time"

So globally, in theory, is at 50% (or is it 62.5%) haste with 24k mastery and a the rest in crit.
But it's also a good thing to keep in mind that it's in theory and things will change again boss in the game.
Everything suggests 62.5% as a result of the amplification trinket. However I think the playstyle is too fast for a lot of people so they go back down to 50%. The difference between them is so small it's better to go with what's more comfortable.

I'm a freak so I'm going even higher :P
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Re: [TC][ilvl 579-582] Frost Stats & 18974 Haste

Unread postby Windofwinter Mon Jun 30, 2014 9:27 pm

I was doing some sims today with my own gear. I decided to go play around and see how true 2 secondary stats vs 1 intellect was. Pretty much everyone now has 50% haste, easy to get so i wanted to see how mastery stacked up against Intellect on multi target fights. I came up with some interesting results. I tried hectic/add/cleave and then i tried just light movement against 3 enemy targets.(yes i know simc keeps all targets alive the entire fight, yes i know that is not realistic but want to see the difference between that and hectic/add/cleave) Really no fight is tank and spank, there is always a little movement, so i personally think it is more realistic. (correct me if i am wrong)

There really is no "true" single target fight except for IJ and somewhat Malkorok so we always have Adds or multiple bosses, so really i think single target dps does not matter too much. (my opinion)

The results i got were kind of interesting, showed that in movement and against multiple adds, intellect was better. Trying to figure out how to post a full result of a simc result so that way i can show what i mean

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