Sugge's [Mage] Guide to Blackrock Foundry [Heroic/Mythic]

[Sugg3]

Great guide.
I only have one question. I am full Frost (Multistrike) right now. You said that Arcane and fire are superior.
So I assume I should only farming the arcane and fire gear in BRF.

Should I change my spec right now even before I got any other gear? Or should I stay frost until a get a lot of new gear? This would likely end in decreasing my DPS at first if I get "better" gear but without MS.

What would be your plan?

In your case, I would definitely stay as Frost until I got the proper mastery (Arcane) and (Fire) to play each of those specialization. For now I would stay Frost for ALL boss encounters, that includes Beastlord Darmac and The Iron Maidens aswell. The reason I say that is because (by the looks of it) you currently do not possess any crit trinket + that your crit is extremely low.

You're going to do fine in BRF as Frost with the ammount of multistrike that you have. Just make sure to play with http://www.wowhead.com/spell=112948/frost-bomb on Cleave/AoE fights.

[Anarza]

Excellent post. I have very similar thoughts regarding the spec choice and overall gameplay.

On the Oregorger encounter, is it possible to completely soak the Acid Torrent via Evanesce?

On the Blast encounter, can we Spellsteal the Reactive Sheilds (the 30% heal, not 10%) from the Primal Elementalists?

Just some stray thoughts I had. I'll probably be testing these once BRF opens up.

[Faenya]

Anyone recall offhand where there's a link to a spreadsheet for all the BIS pieces for BRF? There was a pretty comprehensive one I stumbled upon before but forgot to bookmark it.

[Sugg3]

Excellent post. I have very similar thoughts regarding the spec choice and overall gameplay.

On the Oregorger encounter, is it possible to completely soak the Acid Torrent via Evanesce?

As http://www.wowhead.com/spell=156324/acid-torrent is just a flat amount of damage dealt it should be able to be soaked with http://www.wowhead.com/spell=157913/evanesce. Altough I recommend you to use http://www.wowhead.com/spell=108839/ice-floes as you're going to want to move during Feeding Frenzy.

On the Blast encounter, can we Spellsteal the Reactive Sheilds (the 30% heal, not 10%) from the Primal Elementalists?

I have not yet been able to confirm this, but my guess would be like in Highmaul (raid instance)... you can't http://www.wowhead.com/spell=30449/spellsteal anything, only dispell their current buff. But as Arcane you're going to want to avoid this due to the high mana cost of http://www.wowhead.com/spell=30449/spellsteal. Leave the dispelling to other classes like shamans, hunters and priest unless you're playing Fire or Frost.

[zhengma]

...that includes Beastlord Darmac...

I don't see how should Frost be inferior in this fight. Here is my plan: save http://www.wowhead.com/spell=84714 when a http://www.wowhead.com/spell=154975 is imminent. Right as it is cast, put a http://www.wowhead.com/spell=112948 on Darmac, then when the adds are gathered by the tank, pop http://www.wowhead.com/spell=84714 (and http://www.wowhead.com/spell=55342 and http://www.wowhead.com/spell=12472 if BOTH are ready), then lance the living heck out of Darmac. With that number of targets and http://www.wowhead.com/spell=155149 it'll be easy to get the 10 lances to cover the entire http://www.wowhead.com/spell=55342 duration with IV. If they don't die out by then, I'm even happier, due to http://www.wowhead.com/spell=157727.

How well it'll work depends on how frequent http://www.wowhead.com/spell=154975 is cast. http://www.wowhead.com/spell=84714 is 60 sec CD, which can be reduced by http://www.wowhead.com/spell=157727. http://www.wowhead.com/spell=11129 is 90 sec CD glyphed and 45 sec CD unglyphed, which can be reduced by http://www.wowhead.com/spell=155148. Which of these two fits better in the timeline of http://www.wowhead.com/spell=154975?

[Sugg3]

...that includes Beastlord Darmac...

I don't see how should Frost be inferior in this fight. Here is my plan: save http://www.wowhead.com/spell=84714 when a http://www.wowhead.com/spell=154975 is imminent. Right as it is cast, put a http://www.wowhead.com/spell=112948 on Darmac, then when the adds are gathered by the tank, pop http://www.wowhead.com/spell=84714 (and http://www.wowhead.com/spell=55342 and http://www.wowhead.com/spell=12472 if BOTH are ready), then lance the living heck out of Darmac. With that number of targets and http://www.wowhead.com/spell=155149 it'll be easy to get the 10 lances to cover the entire http://www.wowhead.com/spell=55342 duration with IV. If they don't die out by then, I'm even happier, due to http://www.wowhead.com/spell=157727.

How well it'll work depends on how frequent http://www.wowhead.com/spell=154975 is cast. http://www.wowhead.com/spell=84714 is 60 sec CD, which can be reduced by http://www.wowhead.com/spell=157727. http://www.wowhead.com/spell=11129 is 90 sec CD glyphed and 45 sec CD unglyphed, which can be reduced by http://www.wowhead.com/spell=155148. Which of these two fits better in the timeline of http://www.wowhead.com/spell=154975?

As he will cast http://www.wowhead.com/spell=154975 every 30 seconds, and with Fire's superior AoE/Cleave combined with an unglyphed http://www.wowhead.com/spell=11129 for a 45 + ( -1 * crits) CD using http://www.wowhead.com/spell=155148. I see no reason why Frost should pull ahead.

Updated the guide to show how frequently http://www.wowhead.com/spell=154975. Helping players to optimize their setup. Thanks for pointing this out and keep asking these type of questions so I can make the guide as clear as possible!

[Kypes]

Great guide.
I only have one question. I am full Frost (Multistrike) right now. You said that Arcane and fire are superior.
So I assume I should only farming the arcane and fire gear in BRF.

Should I change my spec right now even before I got any other gear? Or should I stay frost until a get a lot of new gear? This would likely end in decreasing my DPS at first if I get "better" gear but without MS.

What would be your plan?

In your case, I would definitely stay as Frost until I got the proper mastery (Arcane) or crit (Fire) to play each of those specialization. For now I would stay Frost for ALL boss encounters, that includes Beastlord Darmac and The Iron Maidens aswell. The reason I say that is because (by the looks of it) you currently do not possess any crit trinket + that you're crit is extremely low.

You're going to do fine in BRF as Frost with the ammount of multistrike that you have. Just make sure to play with http://www.wowhead.com/spell=112948/frost-bomb on Cleave/AoE fights.

Thanks for your quick reply, was really helpul.
So I should go in as frost and stay at it until I get enough other gear.

Since I cant just get all the loot, what should I aim for?
Crit and Mastery for fire?

So lets say a MS+Crit drops, I would not take it if I know I wouldnt use it at all.



Another question which is way off topic: (Dont answer if it is too complicated)
If I want to compare two different sets of talents in simcraft. How do I do it? I managed to load two automatic profiles but then there is no gear. If I just load two default profiles and change the talents, the action priority will be the same. Are there any profiles I could import?

[Sugg3]

Great guide.
I only have one question. I am full Frost (Multistrike) right now. You said that Arcane and fire are superior.
So I assume I should only farming the arcane and fire gear in BRF.

Should I change my spec right now even before I got any other gear? Or should I stay frost until a get a lot of new gear? This would likely end in decreasing my DPS at first if I get "better" gear but without MS.

What would be your plan?

In your case, I would definitely stay as Frost until I got the proper mastery (Arcane) or crit (Fire) to play each of those specialization. For now I would stay Frost for ALL boss encounters, that includes Beastlord Darmac and The Iron Maidens aswell. The reason I say that is because (by the looks of it) you currently do not possess any crit trinket + that you're crit is extremely low.

You're going to do fine in BRF as Frost with the ammount of multistrike that you have. Just make sure to play with http://www.wowhead.com/spell=112948/frost-bomb on Cleave/AoE fights.

Thanks for your quick reply, was really helpul.
So I should go in as frost and stay at it until I get enough other gear.

Since I cant just get all the loot, what should I aim for?
Crit and Mastery for fire?

So lets say a MS+Crit drops, I would not take it if I know I wouldnt use it at all.

What you should aim for is firstly to get the 4-set bonus. After that you will start picking up pieces that are already better for your current equipment, that piece will be best in slot for either Arcane and Fire. Eventually you will take a path leaning towards either Arcane of Fire and start picking up more epics accordingly.

Another question which is way off topic: (Dont answer if it is too complicated)
If I want to compare two different sets of talents in simcraft. How do I do it? I managed to load two automatic profiles but then there is no gear. If I just load two default profiles and change the talents, the action priority will be the same. Are there any profiles I could import?

The logs with the executed profile should be saved when using Simulationcraft. Just make sure to log out properly inbetween changing talents since Simulationcraft will load the profile from your armory. If you need further help just use any search engine and you should probably get the help you're looking for.

[zhengma]

If I want to compare two different sets of talents in simcraft. How do I do it? I managed to load two automatic profiles but then there is no gear. If I just load two default profiles and change the talents, the action priority will be the same. Are there any profiles I could import?

If you had actually examined the default APL (Action Priority List), you'll find that it has already taken all talents into account. Some of the lines will only be executed if a talent is picked. For example:

Code: Select all

call_action_list,name=crystal_sequence,if=talent.prismatic_crystal.enabled&(cooldown.prismatic_crystal.remains<=gcd.max|pet.prismatic_crystal.active)

will not be executed at all if you've picked Thermal Void, in which case talent.prismatic_crystal.enabled==false.

Besides, you should simulate based on your own gear, which can be imported from your Armory, in contrast to simulate based on "default profile", by which I assume you mean a profile with some default gear.

[zhengma]

What you should aim for is firstly to get the 4-set bonus. After that you will start picking up pieces that are already better for your current equipment, that piece will be best in slot for either Arcane and Fire. Eventually you will take a path leaning towards either Arcane of Fire and start picking up more epics accordingly.

While I fully agree with this paragraph, I'm quite pessimistic with how that can be realistically achieved. Why? Take a glimpse at my humble roster, and tell me how many "Vanquisher" do you see here.

EDIT: if anyone here can write an argument for me that I can present to my raid leader, showing why I, before all these Vanquishers do, should get a token, I'll be most grateful.

[minimemage]

As Arcane you're going to want with go with http://www.wowhead.com/item=113876/toot ... ps&bonus=0 as off piece since they have...
1. Mastery and Haste as secondary stats, being the best stats for Arcane.
2. http://www.wowhead.com/item=115552/arca ... es&bonus=0 has Crit and Haste on them, which are the second worst combination of seconary stats for the T17 set for Arcane specifically.

Same principle will go for Fire which you can read about under Coin List.

Keep posting questions like this so I can update and make the guide as direct and clear as possible!

Sorry to ask the same question again - but in a raid with other people it doesn't make sense to go for 5 different set pieces (3 same, +pants for Arc, +gloves for Fire) when others are competing for vanq 4 sets, right? The offset pants (Turret mechanic legs) seem like they can be the best choice with mastery and crit, to support both specs (since set pants have multi).

[zhengma]

Sorry to ask the same question again - but in a raid with other people it doesn't make sense to go for 5 different set pieces (3 same, +pants for Arc, +gloves for Fire) when others are competing for vanq 4 sets, right? The offset pants (Turret mechanic legs) seem like they can be the best choice with mastery and crit, to support both specs (since set pants have multi).

I said something similar in my loot plan requested by my RL. It's long been submitted to her and it might be too late to change:(

[Sugg3]

What you should aim for is firstly to get the 4-set bonus. After that you will start picking up pieces that are already better for your current equipment, that piece will be best in slot for either Arcane and Fire. Eventually you will take a path leaning towards either Arcane of Fire and start picking up more epics accordingly.

While I fully agree with this paragraph, I'm quite pessimistic with how that can be realistically achieved. Why? Take a glimpse at my humble roster, and tell me how many "Vanquisher" do you see here.

EDIT: if anyone here can write an argument for me that I can present to my raid leader, showing why I, before all these Vanquishers do, should get a token, I'll be most grateful.

I realise that I might have expressed myself wrongly. What I meant by that statement was more of a clarification that no matter what off-set pieces you pick up (not including weapons and trinkets) the 2-4 set bonuses will be the biggest damage gain to your damage output.

You also have to take into account that when you are going to bonus roll from different bosses, you might end up with pieces that you originally didn't plan on using. If you gather two or three of these pieces while also having some progress in achieving the T17 set. My statement should make alittle bit more sense. :p

If you take a look at this spreadsheet and forward it to your raid leader, you might convince your her to give you prior access to Vanquisher pieces, not likely though.

[Sugg3]

As Arcane you're going to want with go with http://www.wowhead.com/item=113876/toot ... ps&bonus=0 as off piece since they have...
1. Mastery and Haste as secondary stats, being the best stats for Arcane.
2. http://www.wowhead.com/item=115552/arca ... es&bonus=0 has Crit and Haste on them, which are the second worst combination of seconary stats for the T17 set for Arcane specifically.

Same principle will go for Fire which you can read about under Coin List.

Keep posting questions like this so I can update and make the guide as direct and clear as possible!

Sorry to ask the same question again - but in a raid with other people it doesn't make sense to go for 5 different set pieces (3 same, +pants for Arc, +gloves for Fire) when others are competing for vanq 4 sets, right? The offset pants (Turret mechanic legs) seem like they can be the best choice with mastery and crit, to support both specs (since set pants have multi).

Of course you should not go directly for five different set pieces, that would just be rude. Take note that I posted that statement under the impression that we were talking about "bonus rolls". Meaning that IF you are planning on playing as Fire at any point. Definitely roll on this boss, since you will not only have a chance to obtain a set piece, you will also have a chance to loot the optimal off-piece (legs in this case) to use when playing as Fire.

[Laere]

You should update the coin list section.

Gruul drops crit/mastery boots which are BiS for fire. Also, fire 4pc puts mastery ahead of crit from what I have been reading and seeing, so even some arcane pieces might be in alignment with fire as we get tier.

[Sugg3]

You should update the coin list section.

Gruul drops crit/mastery boots which are BiS for fire. Also, fire 4pc puts mastery ahead of crit from what I have been reading and seeing, so even some arcane pieces might be in alignment with fire as we get tier.

I had someone message me about the boots already so that should be fixed by now.
Concerning the Mastery > Crit. This statpriority starts to take into place when you have the 2-set bonus and will still only go for "multiple" targets. This "multiple" target is not two (the basic cleave encounter) if I remember correctly, (will check for exact numbers tomorrow when I wake up). But the point you are raising are still very important.

As it is for now, during the first week. The Coin List is up to date and should still concern Mages who haven't acquired either the 2-set or preferably 4-set bonus.

And even though all of this Crit is still going to be better then Mastery for single target (possibly on cleave aswell). So I might have revise the whole Coin List (possibly only show weapons, trinkets and set-pieces) and/or possibly give some more clearification by creating a BiS list of some sort. To elimnate any (This is best for multitarget fights but is inferior on single target etc) or possibly link items which are BiS for both specs according to what bosses you should be playing what spec for. If the later case, Arcane and Fire would have the same gear which would be the smartest of choices.

Continue to ask these types of questions so I can keep the guide as clear as possible.

[Festen]

Hi

Just thank you for this guide!

[Sugg3]

Hi

Just thank you for this guide!

Glad you liked it!

[Allysonna]

When I looked at the Coin List last night, I would have sworn that Blackhand Doomstaff was on that list for Fire. Now I do not see that weapon, or any other weapon (+off-hand?) listed for Fire.

Did I miss something some where?

Thanks for making this guide. I'm passing it along to the other mages in my guild.

[Sugg3]

When I looked at the Coin List last night, I would have sworn that Blackhand Doomstaff was on that list for Fire. Now I do not see that weapon, or any other weapon (+off-hand?) listed for Fire.

Did I miss something some where?

Thanks for making this guide. I'm passing it along to the other mages in my guild.

You're completely right, I rewamped the list due to "request". The staff that drops from Gruul will do "better" as an overall staff for both Fire (after you get 4 set) and Arcane.