Arcane Talent Comparisons, Stat Weights, Racials, Trinkets

[Frosted]

They only exist once you have set bonuses, correct.

[Frosted]

I've done some work at higherhaste ratings, and have with some of what I learned have decided to collapsed my stat priority into one, which should simplify things quite a bit.

Haste 20% (1300rating) > Int > Haste > Mastery=Mult > Crit > Vers

should work for anyone from normal to mythic BiS. Just make sure you read the note I included about stat priorities

[Frostfeierqt]

What's about http://www.wowhead.com/item=112164? Will this be an option with these new stat priorities?

[Frosted]

It's currently used in all arcane BiS profiles

[Darthy]

and burn as deep as possible when you have AP up and the Tome trinket.
means we burn untill were oom and then 4 tick evo, what about our missle proccs then, if we only use them above 70% mana unless were getting a 3 stack that means will be firing tons of missles at a low mana percentage due to reaching 3 stacks of missles while continuously burning until were oom.
is that interpretation correct?

[Zelendria]

I was just thinking about random scenarios and such like....

With AP glyphed
Overpowered
Arc Trinket
Bucket loads of haste...
And some RNG loving

How long could you have AP up for?

Has burning very deep been compared to the affects of 50% with lots of time left on AP in tandem with OP, and whatever the effect is called after a Evo that increases haste and decreases mana cost?
That first rotation now after Evo can last a long time before you finally Barrage especially if you built up 3xAM in the final stages of a burn.
With so much haste on tap and every missile extending AP by 2s, just them 3 stacks would give +6s and have been cast in maybe 3s? If you kept getting lucky with procs on AB's you'd go round in a massive circle of AP extensions doing AB/AM weaving all the while being at 90%+ mana, and even doing a Barrage and building up 4xAB again all with AP still up...Has it been compared to the loss affect of going deep and sitting on a much longer Evo possibly wearing out AP alltogether...

Random questions
Or perhaps I've completely overlooked something in the tooltips of the items that doesn't make this remotely possible...

[Wilderness]

You're not going to glyph AP with the Mage trinket because you will go oom so fast. I've got it and even unglyphed I burn down to 20-30%. With OP and the AP glyph you'll be wasting a ton of AP uptime or not using it effectively b/c you won't be able to burn after using Evo with a lot of AP time left, so you'll end up casting a bunch of less than 4 stack ABs during that time unless you get really lucky with AM procs. I don't see how that could be better than just having 2 deeper burns every 90 seconds.

[Zelendria]

Yea that's what I mean.. Is burning deep giving a better total DPS than using Evo as you do now, and potentially going through your normal conserve still under the affects of the trinket, AP and 90%+ mana.

Like now when you do lust on pull. You burn, Evo and for at least the rest of lust without any HFC gear go through conserves with procs very fast.
Are the 6 or 7 AB's down to OOM better than what could easily be 6 or 7 AB's at 90% mana just doing a typical conserve phase with AP still active due to OP.

[Wilderness]

Yeah, I see what you mean. But unless you get really lucky with AM procs then several of those ABs in your conserve phase are going to be at sub-4 stacks of Arcane Charges. Obviously our mastery means that a 100% AB hits for more than a 10% AB, but the difference isn't nearly as big as between a 0 stack AB and a 4 stack AB. So if average luck results in only 2 of those 7 ABs being at 4 stacks, that's a big difference. Obviously this is just based on reading tooltips and not any actual simulations or real math, but the differences seem rather large.

[Caimion]

Hmm, it's worth some thought - with glyphed AP you end up with more AP during potion uptime as well. What about when you're using Orb, and therefore have a way to skip right back to 4 charges? There's tons of adds running around in HFC just asking to be Orbed.

[Zelendria]

That's another good point although do note that you wouldn't have OP so your burn would have had to have been pretty fast anyway.
If you were sticking with Arcane on a 2/3 target fight say the Council you would AO the two tanked together bringing you up to 3 stacks with potentially 3xAM from the burn. Or if you started with 3 stacks you would AM, AO and now you're sat at 4 stacks.
Now you're going to get, depending on how fast your burn phase was (I suspect with stacked haste, trinket etc extremely fast), at good 4-5 4 stack AB's at 90%+ mana and the AM's instead of the 5-6 at a maximum of say 50% (Using the current accepted point where you really should be doing Evo)

[Chill666]

Did you sim Desecrated Shadowmoon Insignia With iLvL 695 710 and 725 or is it a typo?

[Frosted]

It's with whatever it is in game. I might have typo'd the ilvl.

[Lammer]

Recently I got Prophecy of Fear lvl 700 and Simcraft says that I lose 2k DPS if I replace either Darmac's or Oregorger's mythic trinket. Does it mean that Prophecy is precious, only if you have T18? I still run T17 4-piece gear

[Frosted]

Impossible to tell without a profile linked.

Normal PoF is a significant DPS upgrade for both my mythic trinkets, and I have no tier yet. Guessing you did something wrong.

[Lammer]

Thanks Frosted. It turned out that I was using old Simcraft version. Did an update, got 6.4k DPS increase, if replacing Oregorger's trinket, and 7.2k DPS increase, if replacing Darmac's

[Shangalar]

Do Haste and Unstable Magic only become best stat and best talent once you get the 2 and 4-set bonuses or are they best even before that?

[300kg]

I have a question on the opener with Prophecy of Fear:
When you pull, and prophecy of fear procs before you have put down your crystal and popped arcane power, do you unload all your acquired AMs into the mark(with/without arcane power?), or do you simply ignore it and do a normal rotaion by popping crystal, AP etc.
Ideally it would proc on the crystal, but I could also proc on the crystal when theres 2-3 sec left. Would it not overall be better to always run OP since it would eliminate any "target swap" on the opener and any DPS loss from trinket proccing on an expiring crystal

[Frosted]

Do Haste and Unstable Magic only become best stat and best talent once you get the 2 and 4-set bonuses or are they best even before that?

Most of hastes value comes from the set bonuses. 2pc will let you get upwards of 1300 haste with it being a DPS gain (so long as you are not using mythic darmacs), and the 4pc will extend hastes value beyond that, to result in the stat priority I listed.

UM >SN is basically once you switch over from mastery to haste, as UM gains from haste and SN does not.

[Chiv]

Do Haste and Unstable Magic only become best stat and best talent once you get the 2 and 4-set bonuses or are they best even before that?

Most of hastes value comes from the set bonuses. 2pc will let you get upwards of 1300 haste with it being a DPS gain (so long as you are not using mythic darmacs), and the 4pc will extend hastes value beyond that, to result in the stat priority I listed.

UM >SN is basically once you switch over from mastery to haste, as UM gains from haste and SN does not.

But if you have mythic darmacs...