Why am I so bad at Garrosh? *whine*

[Verraine]

Ugh. Another mediocre Garrosh parse: http://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/xAy ... amage-done

Here's a couple of tidbits about how my guild does this fight:

1. Last night we pushed him into T1 before the second Iron Star.
2. We use potions in T1 since that's the only remaining DPS check for us.
3. We push him to P3 before he gets to T2.
4. In P3 we only spawn a single set of adds, which we all individually kill.

Looking at my parse, I think my biggest culprit may be excessive bomb refreshing. I had 52 casts of LB, some of which were probably a waste because I dotted up the adds in T1. I also managed to munch 8 BF procs, which is frustrating. However, I still feel that even taking these things into account, I'm still much lower than I should be, which leads me to believe I'm making some significant sub-par decisions. I'm just not sure what.

[durrtygoodz]

I wouldn't bother potting on that first transition, you need to fix your low damage there instead. You did 4m damage to those adds with pot, usually I can reach at least 8m with no pot. I've had a couple of good attempts in the past with even 10 to 12million. Which ones are you on? Im on the inside left so when I spawn I throw LBs as I'm running, then put my orb on the pack when I get there, and just go HAM with procs.

http://i.imgur.com/GZHVWkX.png" target="_blank

There's our damage break down comparison for those adds. You're on the left I'm on the right. Most notable difference is the % of my dmg that Frozen Orb and IL makes up compared to yours.

On your log you used CoC twice but it only hit 3 times, so this was essentially 2 completely wasted GCDs. The only time I use CoC is when the phase 1 adds are all together on the boss, and I go for a petfreeze CoC with 2piece active. Might squeeze in another if they live long enough but they're usually dead before 8 seconds.

You are also barely touching the weapons. You always want to have a LB on all active desecrated weapons in the first 2 phases, and if you really want more damage, on the Empowered Desecrated Weapons too.

[Verraine]

I wouldn't bother potting on that first transition, you need to fix your low damage there instead. You did 4m damage to those adds with pot, usually I can reach at least 8m with no pot. I've had a couple of good attempts in the past with even 10 to 12million. Which ones are you on? Im on the inside left so when I spawn I throw LBs as I'm running, then put my orb on the pack when I get there, and just go HAM with procs.

http://i.imgur.com/GZHVWkX.png" target="_blank

There's our damage break down comparison for those adds. You're on the left I'm on the right. Most notable difference is the % of my dmg that Frozen Orb and IL makes up compared to yours.

On your log you used CoC twice but it only hit 3 times, so this was essentially 2 completely wasted GCDs. The only time I use CoC is when the phase 1 adds are all together on the boss, and I go for a petfreeze CoC with 2piece active. Might squeeze in another if they live long enough but they're usually dead before 8 seconds.

You are also barely touching the weapons. You always want to have a LB on all active desecrated weapons in the first 2 phases, and if you really want more damage, on the Empowered Desecrated Weapons too.

I'm in middle then back right. I don't *want* to use a pot during T1, but if I don't and we fail to kill the adds before he gets to 25 energy I'm going to hear it from my raid leader. As far as my low damage; during one of our attempts - might have been the kill, I can't remember - my frost orb got stuck on the ground and didn't actually hit any of the mobs. Good catch on CoC; I must have just flat out missed on a cast.

Also with the weapons; if I damage them I'll get admonished by the raid leader for wasting GCDs on them instead of tunnelling Garrosh. Though, I think that as long as we push him to P3 before T2 I could sneak some in there.

[durrtygoodz]

Well if your raid leader stops you from doing stuff that's going to increase your dps there's not a lot more I can tell you really. Not DoTing the weapons is something new for me at least. Killed Garrosh on 10 and 25 on 5 chars and loads of different teams and never heard anyone say to not DoT/Havoc weapons

[Verraine]

Well if your raid leader stops you from doing stuff that's going to increase your dps there's not a lot more I can tell you really. Not DoTing the weapons is something new for me at least. Killed Garrosh on 10 and 25 on 5 chars and loads of different teams and never heard anyone say to not DoT/Havoc weapons

I think it became an issue when we missed pushing him to P3 by literally a couple of casts. But next week I'm going to try the things you suggested, (which I'm going to henceforth refer to as the "forgiveness strategy") and see how things go.

Don't even get me started on Sha...

[Komma]

Half your living bomb casts didn't trigger an explosion. Sometimes LB also expired on Garrosh before you could refresh it. Watch your LB timer more closely! Also, don't bother refreshing before intermissions; he goes immune.

You had 12 Ice Lances casted without FoF, 10 of which were on Garrosh. I recommend taking Ice Floes instead if you feel like you're running too often and can't keep up your casting time.

It looks a little better when you're looking at Garrosh damage only. Granted, the warlock was on Engineers...

If you're going to use off-GCD CDs together, macro them instead of clicking 1-by-1. You lost a few seconds of casting time over several CD uses like this one:

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00:00:08.063 Verraine casts Frozen Orb 00:00:09.164 Verraine casts Icy Veins 00:00:09.329 Verraine casts Alter Time 00:00:09.662 Verraine casts Ice Lance on Garrosh Hellscream

In an ideal world, Ice Lance would have casted at ~09.063. ~0.6s lost, some of it precious AT time.

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00:06:56.659 Verraine casts Frostbolt on Garrosh Hellscream 00:06:56.979 Verraine casts Icy Veins 00:06:57.128 Verraine casts Alter Time 00:06:57.336 Verraine begins casting Frostfire Bolt

That's another 0.7 secs of CD time lost.

Other examples of not spamming your buttons hard enough!

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00:00:39.881 Verraine casts Living Bomb on Farseer Wolf Rider 00:00:40.535 Verraine casts Temporal Shield 00:00:41.371 Verraine begins casting Frostbolt

Intermission 1:

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00:01:37.134 Verraine casts Living Bomb on Embodied Doubt 13 00:01:38.131 Verraine casts Living Bomb on Embodied Doubt 14 00:01:39.133 Verraine casts Living Bomb on Embodied Doubt 15 00:01:40.740 Verraine casts Ice Lance on Embodied Doubt 13 00:01:41.923 Verraine casts Cone of Cold 00:01:44.927 Verraine casts Living Bomb on Garrosh Hellscream

If an add is dying before 3 ticks, LB isn't worth it.

Between 2 sets of adds in P1, 3 sets of MCs in P2, you should probably be able to use pet freeze 5 times I think?

In general I think it probably burns down mostly to losing cast time. Some of this might be strat related and unavoidable - Looking at Desecrated Weapon damage, I'd guess you're doing a "everyone move together after each desecrate lands on the raid" strat.

Some of DG's advice though, such as LB on weapons, are obviously padding. Do so at your own risk!

[Verraine]

Thanks Komma. I've tried using Ice Floes before, but just can't seem to get the hang of it. It always seems to take a split second for the ability to take effect after I activate it, which throws off my timing.

I take it that half my LBs not triggering an explosion means I've been refreshing them too early, correct?

In terms of macros, would this one work as a single button activation/cancellation:

/cancelaura Alter Time
/cast Icy Veins
/cast Alter Time

[Komma]

I take it that half my LBs not triggering an explosion means I've been refreshing them too early, correct?

Yes.

In terms of macros, would this one work as a single button activation/cancellation:

/cancelaura Alter Time
/cast Icy Veins
/cast Alter Time

Not sure about this macro. It seems like you're fitting two very different functions into one button.

[macca]

/cancelaura Alter Time
/cast Icy Veins
/cast Alter Time

That's one weird macro :s

[Spirillum]

/cancelaura Alter Time won't reset your health/mana/buffs back to when you initially entered Alter Time.

It 'cancels' the effect, which you need from time to time. To end Alter Time early you just hit AT a second time.

[Verraine]

I see. I was trying to roll cancelling Alter Time into the same button as an Icy Veins + AT macro so I could save a button. I haven't actually created any macro yet.

[Spirillum]

I see. I was trying to roll cancelling Alter Time into the same button as an Icy Veins + AT macro so I could save a button. I haven't actually created any macro yet.

You need two buttons because you're talking about two different things

[durrtygoodz]

I see. I was trying to roll cancelling Alter Time into the same button as an Icy Veins + AT macro so I could save a button. I haven't actually created any macro yet.

Depends what you want to do with it. Cancelling the Alter Time aura and coming out of AT early are two different things.

/cancelaura acts as though you never used AT (you dont return to position or get the extension on buffs)
Ending it early is the same as letting it end after 6 seconds but just allows you to manually end it a second or two early.

To end it early you just need to press AT again, you don't need a macro for this.

You definitely don't want to macro /cancelaura in with your main AT button. You can have it on a separate button though just incase. I have it but I can't remember ever using it as frost tbh.

[Verraine]

I think I'll just leave AT & IV on separate buttons for now so I don't have to retrain my fingers. I'll just have to live with the .208 seconds wasted.

[Stressball]

I think I'll just leave AT & IV on separate buttons for now so I don't have to retrain my fingers. I'll just have to live with the .208 seconds wasted.

You should have them on two separate buttons anyway. You have a much better chance of proccing PBoI with IV up than without it, so you shouldn't only be popping IV with AT.

[Komma]

It's less about your button configuration and how you use them, really. if you're using them seperately, queueing a spell immediately after each use will remove the downtime. If you're using them together, then you should macro them. I'm guessing that you click your CDs, so why not make a macro with modifiers (ie. /cast [mod:shift] Alter Time) in case you want to activate both at the same time?

It's 'minor', but losing 3-4 seconds of Icy Veins/Alter Time burst means a lot in the context of a 400 second fight - that's easily 1-2% of your DPS, which is worth more than any non-weapon gear upgrade.

[Verraine]

Well I'm going in the right direction, at least:

http://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/7rt ... &source=65

How do I look up my bomb explosions? Is that what the 2nd Living Bomb entry is on the damage chart?

[Komma]

How do I look up my bomb explosions? Is that what the 2nd Living Bomb entry is on the damage chart?

Yep! Usually it should be ~10% of tick damage on single target fights.

I'll check out your log later.

[Komma]

Well I'm going in the right direction, at least:

http://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/7rt ... &source=65
How do I look up my bomb explosions? Is that what the 2nd Living Bomb entry is on the damage chart?

This log actually looks like you played a little worse than the first time. Your Garrosh damage (which is what I look at primarily) is a bit lower. You munched 23 BFs and casted a lot more non-FoF Ice Lances.

I think it's just about playing better and sharpening your execution at this point Choreograph your movements ahead of time, and plan your movement abilities/instants with them. Plan ahead what to do with your camera so you don't suffer as much downtime from target change. Minimize your casting time lost from use off-GCD abilities or items such as temporal shield, counterspell and healthstone usage.

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00:06:04.862 Verraine casts Living Bomb on Garrosh Hellscream 00:06:08.928 Verraine casts Counterspell on Braavos 00:06:09.611 Verraine begins casting Frostbolt

4 full seconds of standing there, doing nothing but trying to click a guildie for MCs!

That said, don't expect to magically rise to the top of Skada even if you improve your play greatly. The competing classes in your raid perform strongly on the fight as well, and Frost isn't the best spec for maximizing numbers. You're already farming Garrosh and have a 80 percentile parse, so why think about it too much?

[Verraine]

This log actually looks like you played a little worse than the first time. Your Garrosh damage (which is what I look at primarily) is a bit lower. You munched 23 BFs and casted a lot more non-FoF Ice Lances.

I munched how many BF procs?!?!?! I'm speechless. Even accounting for the ones I always munch trying to ensure I have a full set of procs going into T1, I can't believe I munched that many. /wrists

I think it's just about playing better and sharpening your execution at this point Choreograph your movements ahead of time, and plan your movement abilities/instants with them. Plan ahead what to do with your camera so you don't suffer as much downtime from target change. Minimize your casting time lost from use off-GCD abilities or items such as temporal shield, counterspell and healthstone usage.

I already do this, it's just movement on this fight is really awkward. The #1 thing that frustrates me is the fact that I always lose my focus target when Garrosh comes out of T1.

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00:06:04.862 Verraine casts Living Bomb on Garrosh Hellscream 00:06:08.928 Verraine casts Counterspell on Braavos 00:06:09.611 Verraine begins casting Frostbolt

4 full seconds of standing there, doing nothing but trying to click a guildie for MCs!

I had an absolute bitch of a time switching targets on that kill; I really think I need to check out tidyplates because having them move around makes it difficult to acquire targets and mouse-over targeting doesn't work. The other annoying thing that happened is that I was unable to re-designate Garrosh as my focus target after he came out of T1, and didn't realize it.

That said, don't expect to magically rise to the top of Skada even if you improve your play greatly. The competing classes in your raid perform strongly on the fight as well, and Frost isn't the best spec for maximizing numbers. You're already farming Garrosh and have a 80 percentile parse, so why think about it too much?

I know I'm not going to be able to out-dps some of the other classes (grrr, stupid ele shammy), but I at least want to do well for a frost mage. The thing that bugs me about Garrosh especially is that it's one of the least RNG fights, so the way I see it Garrosh is a better gauge of pure playing skill. I'm just a perfectionist, really.

Edit: Oh yeah, one other thing I forgot to mention is that the stupid hunter pulled at the beginning of the countdown, before I even Evocated and why I only used 1 pot during the fight.