Frost Talents, Stat Weights, Racials, Trinkets, FAQ

[Frosted]

A ton of people are asking about stat weights and how talents compare, so I've gone ahead and run all the current talent iterations and sim'd out their respective stat weights. This is why you see some people saying vers is bad, or haste is bad - they've probably sim'd the talent setup they are using and seen those values shift around. To see how you want to gear, check out the stat weights for whatever talent combo you're using. (or sim yourself! I wrote a guide on how to do so over in the General section)

Note: ALL talent combos have IV glyphed.

NOTE: If you are having problems with SimC, or think something is wrong, you MUST include a pastebin (pastebin.com) of the profile you ran which brought about the problem. It is 100% impossible for anyone to help you figure out why some weird thing (like CC being shown as worthless in SimC, which is a common problem people have) if you do not do this.

Table of Contents:
1)Single Target Talent Comparisons - HFC
2)Single Target Stat Weights - HFC
3)Two Target Talent Comparisons - HFC
4)Three Target Talent Comparisons - HFC
5)Frost Racials
6)Trinket Comparsions
6)Frequently Asked Questions

Single Target

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Single Target Stat Weights

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Two target (stacked):

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Three target (stacked):

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Racials

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Trinkets

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Simple Trinket Chart:



Pairwise Comparisons:

downloads.simulationcraft.org/Frost/2015_7_16_frostH_pairwise_trinkets.html

Frequently Asked Questions

Q1 ) Should I be holding Frozen Orb for Prismatic Crystal?

A1 ) Yes. In almost every scenario it is a DPS increase



Q2 ) Should I delay MI for IV?

A2 ) No, for both Glyphed and Unglyphed.



Q3 ) If I have Copelands Clarity, should I hold off on using it to sync with IV?

A3a ) Definitely not if you have MI as well



A3b ) If you don't have MI, it's fine either way.



Q4 ) How do I figure out what stats I want to get after MS?

A4 ) You sim yourself. There is no other real way to do it. There is no "MS > x > y > z " standard rule for Frost mage stat weights. It's very reliant upon your gear and talents. You must sim yourself.

Q5 ) What is the best weapon enchant?

A5 ) Thunderlord/Frostwolf



Q6) When can I go X spec? When does Fire > Frost on single target? Or = Frost? What about arcane? (OUTDATED)



Q7) But I really want a Stat Priority?
A7) Int>MS>=Crit>Haste>Vers>Mastery

Q8) Trinkets?
A9) Tome + Unblinking Gaze

Q9) "BiS"?
A9)

Code: Select all

head=countenance_of_the_revenant,id=124158,bonus_id=566 neck=choker_of_forbidden_indulgence,id=124391,bonus_id=566,enchant=gift_of_multistrike shoulders=mantle_of_the_arcanic_conclave,id=124177,bonus_id=566 back=cloak_of_hideous_unity,id=124138,bonus_id=566,enchant=gift_of_multistrike chest=robe_of_the_arcanic_conclave,id=124171,bonus_id=566 wrists=powdersinged_bracers,id=124183,bonus_id=566 hands=gloves_of_the_arcanic_conclave,id=124154,bonus_id=566 waist=demonbuckle_sash_of_argus,id=124200,bonus_id=566 legs=pantaloons_of_the_arcanic_conclave,id=124165 feet=bloody_daggerheeled_pumps,id=124149,bonus_id=566 finger1=loathful_encrusted_band,id=124192,bonus_id=566,enchant=gift_of_multistrike finger2=spellbound_runic_band_of_the_allseeing_eye,id=118306,enchant=gift_of_multistrike trinket1=tome_of_shifting_words,id=124516,bonus_id=566 trinket2=unblinking_gaze_of_sethe,id=124229,bonus_id=566 main_hand=edict_of_argus,id=124382,bonus_id=566,enchant=mark_of_the_frostwolf

Q10) What has changed in 6.2?
A10) Not much, unless you have the Tome trinket! If you do, you want to be weaving Frostbolt/FoF-Ice lance constantly. Yes, even on Prismatic Crystal, you want to be weaving. Even with FBomb. WJ strategy has also changed - it might be best just to use it as soon as it's up and you can get value from it. Just keeping it on CD may be best, but this still needs to be looked into.

[smartys]

thanks for the work ! Would be awesome if this could be done for arcane too

[Israfael]

What kind of gear and ilvl were these sims made with? Also, if it's possible, can you please rank the pre-raid trinkets, I have my doubts what to use and whether i should get DMC card in pair to the Copeland's clarity (wowhead says it's 220 crit, while Bnet gives us 220 int. Also, in the comment section someone mentions that blizz nerfed the proc by 300 sp)

[Berlinia]

Copeland's CLarity is BiS till Foundry for frost.

[oomy]

Everything pre-raid seems pretty equal

[Israfael]

Copeland's CLarity is BiS till Foundry for frost.

Yes, but i was asking about the second trinket (already got CC for merely 75k on my low-pop server ). Now i'm planning to get MS proc trinket from Everbloom, but maybe Haste proc trinket can be better than that for bursting on crystal (since it's all we have in terms of overall output). Or as i was saying in the first post, maybe DMC card trinket would be better than Genesaur's blood (looking at pull variations, burst can vary between 40-60k just because IN doesnt/does crit).

[gormac]

(link to share: http://imgur.com/xylPTft" target="_blank)
I make it from 1st post informations.

[Architech]

Do these sims include the infinite Iv line?

Anecdotally, I saw a 5% dps increase when I commented out the infinite icy veins line in the alp for the um/tv comboes. In my sims I also had the Iv glyph active.

[nathyiel]

There still a 10% disparity between top and low.

I think those profile are optimized around T17 so a few thinks can be optimized, like activing infinite IV or not. And don't forget that they're single target without movement.

[Frosted]

Gear is 630 ilvl.

I'll do Arcane / Fire sometime this weekend. I have the list of preraid trinkets somewhere, can run them once I find it.

Yes, IV extension is in those sims if you have Thermal Void. iirc we tried removing it after they nerfed the base coeff of IL, but some tuning after that caused it to re-gain its place as optimal. If you have some sims to show that it's a DPS loss now, post them up We're always looking to improve the APLs and keep them current.

[Laere]

Copeland's CLarity is BiS till Foundry for frost.

Mythic?

[Frosted]

I've updated the OP with two and three target sim talent comparisons. I think PC is being undervalued in these sims due to the Fbomb being used off PC. Might need to change the APL for these scenarios and re-run the sims. Keep that in mind when you're looking at those.

[gillon]

Some of the rows refer to it as IN and others as nova, but I'm assuming both are referring to Ice Nova, correct?

Also, much thanks for doing this, confirms some of the things I've been seeing in sims as well.

[Frosted]

Ah fuck - I fucked up my find/replace T.T.

Nova = Ice Nova.

IN = Fbomb...I'll have to re-run and fix that!

[minimemage]

Copeland's CLarity is BiS till Foundry for frost.

CC seems to have been nerfed; Its not +int and its on use is less than the current tooltip.
http://www.wowhead.com/item=118878#comments:id=2042622" target="_blank

This trinket has been stealth nerfed. It now gives 1100 spellpower on use, down from 1467 spellpower. Blizzard can't update tooltips of nerfs without releasing a patch, so the tooltip remains at 1467 spellpower but when you use the trinket, you only gain 1100 spellpower shown in the character stats.

[Frosted]

Alright, fixed the OP.

[Wilderness]

Do these sims include the infinite Iv line?

Anecdotally, I saw a 5% dps increase when I commented out the infinite icy veins line in the alp for the um/tv comboes. In my sims I also had the Iv glyph active.

What does the infinite IV line do? I understand that casting IL with TV extends IV for 2 seconds, but its not clear to me (and I tried searching so forgive me if I overlooked it) if you change your rotation to keep IV up indefinitely, as that would seem to come down to just spamming IL eventually, or something else.

[Frosted]

Do these sims include the infinite Iv line?

Anecdotally, I saw a 5% dps increase when I commented out the infinite icy veins line in the alp for the um/tv comboes. In my sims I also had the Iv glyph active.

What does the infinite IV line do? I understand that casting IL with TV extends IV for 2 seconds, but its not clear to me (and I tried searching so forgive me if I overlooked it) if you change your rotation to keep IV up indefinitely, as that would seem to come down to just spamming IL eventually, or something else.

You just cast IL every time IV drops below some buff duration remaining - so you end up doing spell -> IL -> spell -> IL -> Spell -> iL...you get the idea. SimC does it by just using ice lance if IV has less than 6s remaining, and if IV is not about to come back off cooldown. it should only be doing that if you have MI and TV though.

[Mumrit]

Excellent work!

[Beeblespark]

Ah fuck - I fucked up my find/replace T.T.

Nova = Ice Nova.

IN = Fbomb...I'll have to re-run and fix that!

Hi, did you alread fix that, because currently there are "Fbomb"s and "IN"s still in the pics.